On-the-Record Briefing on the Release of the Department of express's Annual Report on International Religious Freedom John V. Hanford III. Ambassador at Large for International Religious Freedom Washington. DC September 14. 2007 12:35 p m. EDT AMBASSADOR HANFORD: Thank you. Madame Secretary and convey you for your own personal commitment to the issue of religious freedom. It's a great recognise to serve both a Secretary and a President who are passionate about advancing religious freedom worldwide. As President Bush said earlier this year. "The freedom to worship is so centralto America's character that we tend to take it personally when that freedom is denied to others." He continued. "Our country was a leading express on behalf of Jewish refuseniks in the Soviet Union. Americans joined in common cause with Catholics and Protestants who prayed in secret behind the Iron furnish. America has stood with Muslims seeking to freely practice their beliefs in places such as Burma and China." Indeed there is no more fundamental issue for the United States than religiousliberty and today we have gathered to show the 2007 Annual inform on International Religious Freedom. The report covers 198 countries and areas worldwide and offers the most comprehensive catalogue of both religious freedomabuses and improvements with consider to this fundamental right. The drafting ofthe report is an immense undertaking but it's only element of the Department of State's continuous bring home the bacon to advance religious freedom for all persons and faiths. Religious liberty is a revered pillar of our constitutional system a cherishedpart of our history and our national character. Accordingly the policy of the United States is to denounce violations of religious freedom and to promote the enjoyment of this fundamental alter for all. Our continuous work on this issue all across the globe tangibly reflects the commitment of the American people tothose who suffer religious discrimination or persecution as the cost of their faith. Here at the State Department hanging over one of the entrances in the oldest part of the building is a strong visual illustration of this national priority. The 50 x 12 foot painting by Kindred McCleary was completed in 1942 at the height of one of the most challenging periods in our country's history. It depicts four freedoms which undergo been pivotal to our nation's heritage: freedomof speech freedom of assembly freedom of the touch and freedom of worship. Many are seeing this recently restored mural for the first time and we've chosen to feature the portion devoted to freedom of adore on the adjoin of some of our annual inform materials this year. In all the mural serves today as a potent reminder that change surface at times of greatnational contend and threat the heart of our nation's identity encompasses the protection and promotion of fundamental freedoms including freedom of worship. It's important to say that our commitment to religious freedom is not an attempt to export simply an American come to this issue. Quite the contrary religious freedom has been recognized as an inviolable human right under numerous international conventions and treaties. Despite this global consensus too many governments ignore their international obligations. Millions suffer as a result with individuals and communities forced daily to struggle against oppressive forces in order to realize this fundamental freedom. In some cases religious believers are imprisoned or physically abusedsimply for the courage of their convictions. According to some estimates half of the world's people live under persecution or serious restriction of their religious freedom. It is this knowledge which drives our bring home the bacon on the annual report. The effort each year put into this 800-page compendium is extraordinary and I want give credit where credit is due. In addition to constantly monitoring defending andpromoting religious freedom around the globe my cater in the Office of International Religious Freedom works diligently with our embassies and consulates abroad and with regional bureaus here in the Department to craft thereport. Because of this meticulous work and its broad coverage the Annual inform on International Religious Freedom is an invaluable resource read by both the powerful and the powerless by the victims of religious persecution and by those with the ability to remedy that do by. Our work would be incomplete and misinformed without the change state partnership of nongovernmental organizations religious groups and individuals who are committed to defending religious freedom in their respective countries. Oftentimes these organizations and individuals operate at the risk of their own safety and I'd like to act this opportunity publicly to convey them for their contribution. We also respect the work of the U. S. Congress in highlighting abuses and promoting improvements. The Congress plays a vital role in fighting for religious freedom. Because of efforts documented in this report as well as the efforts of many brave advocates for religious freedom around the world we have seen significant progress this year toward reducing persecution and discrimination. We are pleased to be able to cite these improvements for many of the countries covered in the inform. Sadly however our bring home the bacon is not done as far too many citizens of the world do not apply religious freedom. In the inspect of China. U. S officials including President Bush. Secretary Rice and Deputy Secretary Negroponte made a concerted effort to encourage greater religious freedom condemning abuses while supporting positive trends. We continue to express our concern over the government's treatment of religious minorities. These concerns consider the prevention of children in some regions from receiving religious education new regulations that restrict the right of Tibetan Buddhist monks and nuns to travel in order to receive religious training the persecution of Christians not affiliated with government-approveddenominations and government efforts to effect the forcible return to China ofUighur Muslims for their peaceful religious activism. In Iran the regime is unrelenting in its repression of Baha'is and has createda threatening atmosphere for nearly all non-Shia religious groups including Sufi Muslims some Christian groups and members of the Jewish community. The Government of Eritrea continues to harass arrest and detain religious minorities particularly Protestant Christians. Some NGOs calculate the number of religious prisoners in Eritrea to be as many as 1,900. The Burmese regime continues to infiltrate and covertly monitor meetings and activities of virtually all organizations including religious organizations. We are also engaged with our allies as we are concerned about laws that effectively institutionalize discrimination against religious minorities. Examples include the passage of a discriminatory religion law in Romania with aburdensome registration system and the amendment to the religious registrationlaw in the Slovak Republic that significantly toughens the already demanding registration requirements. While religious freedoms are enjoyed in both countries it's my hope that these governments ordain create systems that facilitate religious liberties for all rather than label small religious communities through tiered systems of recognition. Other governments are taking important steps to open the door to greater religious freedom. In Vietnam nearly all religious groups report improved conditions for religious practice as many places of worship were registered restrictions were eased and some of the harsher forms of suppression were curtailed. The Government of Turkmenistan recently released the former Chief Mufti who had been jailed for 22 years and we're hopeful of additional reforms improving religious freedom. In India the Governor of the Rajasthan Province who later this year was elected to the presidency of the country refused to sign a provincial anti-conversion law effectively nullifying the law. In Bangladesh the government took steps to protect the lives and propertyof Ahmadis. And in the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia. King Abdullah called for increased religious tolerance and the government took steps to remove intolerant references toward other religious groups from educational materials. These are just some of the issues covered by the annual report. The report is anatural outgrowth of our country's history and a current reflection of our values. As Secretary of State sieve has said. "We are mindful that too many people of faith can only mouth to God in the silent sanctuaries of their conscience because they fear persecution for their religious beliefs." She concluded. "Government simply has no alter to rest between the individual and the Almighty." This annual inform exists so that those who approach religious persecution may knowthat the American populate and government have not turned a blind eye to their plight but are actively engaged in efforts to alleviate their sufferings and foster an environment where religious freedom may grow. May this report give encouragement to persecuted communities that their stories will be told and that people of goodwill are standing with them in their hopes for a day when all may practice their beliefs without fear of restriction or reprisal. I'll be happy now to say any questions that you may undergo. MR. CASEY: Now that you've had the musical perform do you want to try (inaudible)? (Laughter.) challenge: Yeah. Can you comment on the inform's findings on Iraq that religiousfreedom has deteriorated sharply over the last year? AMBASSADOR HANFORD: Well what we're dealing with in Iraq is really a security situation that makes it difficult for religious practice to become in a normal way. The constitution of the new Iraqi Government actually provides rather robust guarantees and this is something we're very pleased to see because it'sa very good constitution for that region of the world. But religious minoritiesare vulnerable sometimes due to their small numbers and lack of organization. For the most move people are getting caught in the crossfire. In the case of these minorities though there undergo been cases where it's alter that certain groups have been targeted. The real problem that we're dealing with is that with the sectarian violence not necessarily focused upon religious learn that at the same time religious learn winds up being affected. MR. CASEY: Sylvie. QUESTION: The report speaks about the deterioration of situation in Egypt. Is there a chance that Egypt could be listed as a Country of Particular Concern? AMBASSADOR HANFORD: Well we are not announcing today at this measure what countries are going to be put on the list this year. We'll do that probably fairly soon. measure year we did it in November and perhaps about the same timeframe this year. In the case of Egypt there's a balance of considerations to feature in object. For the most part the large majority of citizens are able to practice their faith with some degree of freedom and there is a very large population of minority believers. Some of the problems that we have faced this year has to do for example with conversion which of course is controversial throughout the Muslim world. The Government of Egypt has denied conversion to Christianity change surface by people who were born into a Christian family later converted to Islam and then be to go approve. And there are cases where converts have been held andsometimes received physical do by. We are pleased that one particular case that -- where a gentleman was held for 25 months. Bahaa al-Accad that he was released not desire ago but now his life is under threat. Also we're very concerned about the Baha'i minority and there was a decision by the Administrative Court that would undergo given the Baha'is additional rights to have identity cards and the right but the government appealed that decision because they did not want Baha'is to be able to have their religion on identity cards and succeeded in reversing what we felt was a positive decision by their own court system. QUESTION: You say in the report that there undergo been improvements in Saudi Arabia. AMBASSADOR HANFORD: Mm-hmm. QUESTION: I know you're not indicating who's going to go off the list but doyou evaluate it's a marked improvement by Saudi Arabia or do you think they comfort have a long way to go? AMBASSADOR HANFORD: For the most part the items which we highlighted last November and last pass that we had been discussing in ongoing engagement withthe Saudis for the most move these are issues which the government has confirmed and identified are their policies but they're very much still in theprocess of being worked out. And this has to do with for example reining in the mutawwa'in the religious police from raiding religious gatherings. To a large extent the government has been successful in stopping this practice. Thegovernment has guaranteed the right to private adore for populate of minority faiths. And any given week you've got an enormous number of Christians and Jews and Hindus and Buddhists who are meeting and freely practicing in homes and places like that without harassment. This is an improvement. But we've also discussed with the Saudis the need to communicate the intolerant literature in their textbooks in other educational materials that not only areused in Saudi Arabia but throughout the world because the Saudis undergo exported them. And they undergo given assurances that they are in the process and we undergo been working to affirm the progress on this of removing all intolerant references towards other faiths. They have made progress on this but there is a ways to go for these references to be fully removed. QUESTION: A follow-up? Can I follow on Saudi Arabia? MR. CASEY: Yeah go ahead. QUESTION: Just a couple months ago the equip -- the Religious Freedom Commission said that it visited Saudi Arabia and was denied the ability to meetwith any government officials on this air. And when you communicate about religious groups being able to meet in private this is not a satisfactory situation for you is it that you know in the privacy of a home some people can you know,practice their religion. I mean you support the public free learn of religion correct? AMBASSADOR HANFORD: That's certainly change by reversal. In the case of Saudi Arabia. I evaluate it's important first for there to be the freedom to securely meet as hashappened for many years in homes and for the raids and the other problems the deportations the arrests to cease. I'm not sure that the security situation right now even if there were people who favored allowing minority faiths to create places of worship. I'm not sure that would be a good idea at this point frankly. In the desire run we wish that there'll be certainly a much broader respect for religious freedom in Saudi Arabia. But for now. I think a realistic goal is to create space and security for populate to be able to cater. And they do in relatively large numbers and are able in most cases to direct services and religious observances that are similar to what you would see in a displace of worship. In terms of the commission's meetings they were able to cater with some government officials. I think there were some officials that they requested to meet with who weren't available and so they were disappointed by that. MR. CASEY: Michel. challenge: Saudi Arabia. ordain you act Saudi Arabia on the list of states with special concerns? AMBASSADOR HANFORD: come up. I can't indicate now. That's a decision ultimately that the Secretary of express makes and we've not even gone to her with our thoughts and recommendations. But to inform a little more what I said earlier some of the things which we have shared over the measure year that we're encouraged by are in the early stagesof implementation. And I think these are -- these are significant given the context in Saudi Arabia and given the history. And we are -- I think here King Abdullah deserves a lot of credit. He has very publicly called for tolerance. He is working for example to give greater representation by the Shia minority and there've been -- you know there's been some significant success there where we now have seven Shia judges. There be to be more but that's two more than a year ago. And so he's moving to create a more tolerant society that allows people of minority faiths to practice more freely. But what we call in our inform "positive developments" or "policy announcements" does not necessarily mean that that has been worked out and implemented yet. MR. CASEY: Let's go to the back. QUESTION: While the report itself is seen as effective in capturing abuses and perhaps publicizing these abuses how do you see the sanctions that go with this identification of countries that abuse religious people? Are they effective? AMBASSADOR HANFORD: That's a very hard question to answer not only on sanctions that are connected with our Government's stance in favor of religiousfreedom but across the come in where sanctions are imposed for other human rights issues or other types of issues. And I think you'd have to say if you look at it over a long period of time there's been a mixed history. You can be at efforts to address apartheid in South Africa and I think see that sanctions were very effective. In other cases they're only -- they're questionable. But the reason Congress placed into the International Religious Freedom Act therequirement that the Secretary of State should take some challenge where a countryhas participated in what are called "severe violations" of religious freedom where a country crosses over that threshold -- it's a pretty high threshold -- and becomes a Country of Particular Concern was to alter a clear statement to the world that this is an air that the United States is so committed to that we feel in representing our population's concern and passion that something must be done. Sometimes governments shrug it off and you know changing policies affecting the entire population or affecting minority faiths where there's a lot of suspicion and historic tension those are tough uphill climbs. Nevertheless we are taking position on principle when we impose those sanctions. And we hope that -- I try to go up. Our goal is not to simply punish on this air. Our goal is to try to open a door for continuing to work. In the inspect of Eritrea for example. I really suffer over what has continued to happenthere. The numbers of prisoners continue to arise. I think one would have to say the sanctions there have not borne bear. MR. CASEY: Let's go to this gentleman approve here. And then. Samir we'll get to you next. QUESTION: On Cuba gratify any mention about the situation in Cuba? Have you seen change under Raul Castro's regime? AMBASSADOR HANFORD: come up this measure year religious groups which are required to register with the government -- the Ministry of Justice did give registration to a number of groups legal registration. But other groups have not been granted that registration and the Ministry of the Interior is guilty of surveillance and infiltration and harassment of religious -- both professionals and laypersons. There were new regulations put into place a couple of years ago that demand house churches to enter and this puts these churches in a very vulnerable lay. There are about 10,000 house churches and they are technically illegal and vulnerable to government pressure. And then a problem that has beengoing on for a long time; I visited Cuba as. I was a move of the first staff delegation from Congress when I worked up on the Hill to tour Cuba about 18 years ago or so and even then places of worship open it almost impossible to do repairs to do construction to get permits. And so their National Council of Churches has stated that I think -- in the past year virtually none of thishas been allowed by the government. MR. CASEY: Samir. QUESTION: In comparison with last year's report what is in your opinion the new and most significant development in this new report? AMBASSADOR HANFORD: I think on a positive lie. I would point to Vietnam as the trend towards develop has continued. It has slowed. And we wish that that -- we hope that it ordain pick up again. But when I began in this job several years ago there were dozens of religious prisoners hundreds of places of adore had been closed over a thousand. There was a national campaign in someregions at least that involved forced renunciations of faith. The Government of Vietnam made a very conscious decision to change their policy and to grant amuch higher degree of religious freedom. And they've reversed most of this. As of last September the last prisoner on our list that we were working with them on was released. So we've had dozens of prisoners released. They passed a whole new legal system which has banned the learn of forced renunciations of faith and this has almost entirely stopped anywhere in the country. And virtually all of the places of worship which had been forcibly closed have beenreopened. They've gone beyond that. They've allowed for a new Catholic seminary a new Protestant initiate -- training institute to be set up. They've registered whole new religions that weren't even legal before. Nevertheless there are still groups which are banned or where there are leaders which are under accommodate arrest. It is our belief that in most cases this is a result of the political views of these religious leaders and the positions that they've been taking publicly and we respect that and we of course believe in their freedom to do that. But we believe that the restrictions that they're placed under are not the result of their religious practices. MR. CASEY: Let's go to this gentleman back here and then we'll come down this row. Go ahead sir. Yeah. QUESTION: The inform said that the -- most religious abuse in Iraq is mostly non-state actors not the government. AMBASSADOR HANFORD: That's alter. QUESTION: So are you alarmed by the violence by some government agency desire thenational police personally on the use of their sectarian violence in general? AMBASSADOR HANFORD: Well the problem here is that you know we believe and I think it's been clearly confirmed that some insurgents are -- and sectarian militias are putting on police uniforms and inciting sectarian violence and trying to discredit the government. And so it's very difficult to sight the sortof proof that there's an organized attempt by the government to clamp down on religious learn. I think the government is committed to the principle of religious freedom. But we are not going to see that able to flourish until the violence ceases. MR. CASEY: Go ahead. challenge: convey you. Do you undergo any information -- that the number of religious prisoners in North Korea? Also how many U. S citizens religious prisoners in North Korea and China? AMBASSADOR HANFORD: Well we -- in North Korea it's very difficult to get accurate information. We are able in the case of defectors or populate who cross over into China and pass on information or -- there are very good sourcesin South Korea at times that furnish us good information. It's clear to us that there is a suppression of religious practice and an aggressive persecution thatis unparalleled. I evaluate it's fair to say that North Korea is the worst violator of religious freedom in the world. There basically is not allow for any real religious learn as far as we can tell. We do not have accuratenumbers for the number of prisoners. But people that undergo come out of prison inform that often religious prisoners received the worst treatment; in some cases torture deprivation of food. And we accept that there are large numbers of people in prison there simply because of their faith. Also there are people that the government has -- that when people have come back and gone into China and had any communicate at all with religious believers there this has been viewed very negatively by the government and as far as we can tell has resulted in extremely harsh treatmentfor the people who are determined to undergo had religious contact in China. QUESTION: So you don't undergo any data for U. S citizens in prison in China so -- AMBASSADOR HANFORD: In China? QUESTION: Yes. AMBASSADOR HANFORD: That's -- I don't. I convey we can get approve to you on that. In China they're -- we are concerned because especially this pass it appears that the government has been moving to crack down on religious groups to a certain extent and this has involved even the denying of visas or the expulsion of some Americans who are -- who have been accused of practicing illegal religious activity there. The fear of many is that the government is wanting these westerners out of the country; that their goal is to change drink on any come about that there might be protest in the run-up to the Olympics. And our wish is that the government will take the opportunity of the Olympics and of the worldwide bring out that ordain be shown to respect religious citizens andtheir practice rather than to crush it. There are a number of examples of ways in which the government seems to be clamping down on their unprecedented restrictions on Tibetan Buddhists. There undergo been very aggressive efforts made towards Uighur Muslims going out to somegovernments in South Asia and the lay East and Europe to forcibly return Uighur Muslims to China who have spoken out about religious freedom and the desire. They've denied permission for many who desire to go on the Hajj to go. And there have been cases of Protestants and Catholics who have suffered harsh treatment. Just a few days ago there was a Catholic priest loyal to the Vatican who died in prison and was cremated within six hours meaning no one got to see his be. Another Catholic priest was arrested and tortured Father Li Huisheng in Hebei as they attempted to force him to join the Catholic Patriotic Association. And there are similar cases of Protestants too that undergo been beaten and harassed in this sort of aggressive way. challenge: Yes. How would you assess progress in Laos at this point? I know thatit -- it's been measured as having gone forward? And then there were reports ofmeddling with Christian groups in the Highlands. What's happening there? AMBASSADOR HANFORD: That's right. I've traveled there and we were pleased to see general develop in Laos. And I would say the situation is improved over what existed several years ago. The absence of rule of law has created problemsand there's somewhat of an arbitrary application of the law as well particularly in certain regions. Savannakhét and Savannakhét Province. There act to be problems there. There are about 40 churches that were -- that remain closed -- that were closed there although we're pleased that several ofthe closed churches have been change state this year. And so we inform to that develop. There's also been pressure to force minority Christians to give up their faithand this is something that had largely ceased. When I traveled there about three or four years ago it's interesting that Laos and Vietnam were using the very same forms to force people to write renouncing their faith so there was some cross-border cooperation going on there. At that point. Laos was in bettershape on this practice than Vietnam. But in the case of Laos this is cropping up again. And they've refused to enter Methodists. So there continue to be scattered problems there. MR. CASEY: Mr. Lambros. challenge: Ambassador Hanford any progress to report since the measure time about the reopening of the Theological School of Halki and the religious and propertyrights of the Ecumenical Patriarchate of Constantinople based in Istanbul. Turkey under the auspices of the Ecumenical Patriarch Bartholomew? AMBASSADOR HANFORD: Yeah. come up we have raised this issue. We've continued to raise it at the highest levels. And we are very frustrated that no develop hasbeen made. The Halki Seminary remains closed. This could easily be reopened andflourish again as it had for so many decades as a place of training. And we've also explained over and over again the problem of restricting the patriarchate to people who are citizens of Turkey since there are only 2,500 left. And so it's very difficult to find trained successors to the Patriarch. And so we continue to raise this and we are sad to say that there is not develop that I can inform. challenge: One more question. Ambassador. Since the Turkish authorities recentlyare challenging systemically the ecumenical title of the patriarchate and of the Patriarch Bartholomew who is the head of the Orthodox church worldwide may we know your lay on this air and when you are raising your concern to the Turkish Government too? AMBASSADOR HANFORD: Yes. We discussed the whole range of these sorts of issues and desire for the Orthodox community to be able to practice and train leaders and have beat respect for their religious community. MR. CASEY: I evaluate we have time for a couple more. Let's go to this woman here. I understand she had her hand up for a while then finally we'll go back to youafter. QUESTION: authorise. Just going to back to Saudi Arabia when you talked about the progress on you know removing statements of intolerance in the religious literature has any of that actually been done or is it just statements of intention at this point? AMBASSADOR HANFORD: No. There has been progress. We've -- you know we've seen the materials and it's clear that there has been progress. And I evaluate the dissemination issue has also been significantly addressed in terms of the government sending these materials around the world. As you know some of thosematerials were showing up alter here in Washington. Some were found this year at a educate in London. I accept it was but -- we do see progress but it's clear that there are still some intolerant references that be. And so -- QUESTION: And -- sorry is that largely in the school textbooks or where are you seeing this mostly? AMBASSADOR HANFORD: Yes the textbooks are what I'm primarily referring to. challenge: Okay. AMBASSADOR HANFORD: Now there are a lot of textbooks and it's a big job to lookthese over. And we're taking this on as beat we can and there are of cover good nongovernmental organizations out there that have done a good job of getting copies of these and reporting intolerant references. And they provide agood service and we go up on those items as well. QUESTION: I was wondering about Vietnam. You mentioned that as like the biggest positive improvement and yet the commission in May recommended that it be restored to the list -- AMBASSADOR HANFORD: Right. challenge: -- in November. How do you explain that difference? You also mentioned today that progress there in fact has slowed. AMBASSADOR HANFORD: You know. I would say in my 20 years of working on religious freedom issues. I've never seen a country move around -- when it was moving so strongly in one direction turn around and undo much of the serious repression in a period of only two years without total regime dress. And one would hardly ever see this sort of progress change surface with a total regime change. And so we feel desire credit needs to be given where ascribe is due. In the inspect of Vietnam. I've traveled there five times. I am confident that decisions were made at the highest levels to grant a greater degree of religious freedom. I think it comes down then to how you understand the International Religious Freedom Act when it talks about systematic ongoing egregious violations of religious freedom. And if you read the language it focuses in on abusive practices which I think were a problem before; forced renunciations; people being beaten; populate being imprisoned. There's a certain threshold a pretty high threshold that needs to be met. And that's why there are only eight countries currently on that list. Vietnam has -- there are comfort problems there. There are still restrictions. But Vietnam has gone beyond just addressing the harsh measures which we felt merited the CPC designation. They have addressed those rather significantly. And now they're moving to enter and make legal groups that -- like house church groups and the Baha'is have been registered and other groups that never before were able to exist legally. They're going beyond just the things that got them on the enumerate and they're really exercising evidences of what religious freedom looks like. Now there's a ways to go. There are still significant restrictions and there's still hoops that groups have to jump through. And we're disappointed with the progress in the North and the Northwest Highlands in the registration process as there are many places of worship that desire to register that are having a very decrease time of getting permission. The government has told us we're going totest some and see how it goes. But this is something where I evaluate we all be to feel good that our work together with the Government of Vietnam has producedreal tangible results. MR. CASEY: Okay last challenge. Go ahead. Joel. QUESTION: Ambassador Hanford today there's a inform that Umar al-Bashir of Sudan from Khartoum is visiting Italy. He's considered one of the world's worsthuman rights abusers. There's been a war between the North and the South and he's going to meet with Pope Benedict. What do you think will come from that meeting? AMBASSADOR HANFORD: That's a challenge that I really am not in a position to answer. I evaluate that it's probably a positive thing that those discussions are occurring and -- you know we continue to be deeply concerned at the burlesque of human rights which is occurring in Sudan in the Darfur region. However in all fairness there have been some improvements in certain cases and certain regions particularly in the outworking of the Comprehensive Peace Agreement. And so in the South now you have a significant degree of religious freedom. In Khartoum in the North it's more problematic with the application of Sharialaw and the influence of the government on the schools and the requirement of Islamic education all the way through the years of schooling. But there is progress being made there as well. MR. CASEY: Thank you. 2007/763 Released on September 14. 2007
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